What Does It Mean to "Meet Clients Where They Are"?

Camille McDaniel (00:03.98)
Welcome to another episode of Christ in Private Practice. I’m so glad that you’re here today. If you have been around, welcome back. If you’re new, well, welcome. It’s nice to have you around and I hope that you stick around for some time. So in today’s episode, we’re going to be kind of taking a look at a phrase that has been around. I’m sure you have probably heard it. It’s quite frequently heard of and known within the counseling circles.

And that is meeting clients where they are. And it does, it sounds like a nice thing in theory. And I have, I have had a lot of encounters where I’ve been around that phrase being said, I think the first time that I even came into contact with that phrase was in graduate school. a professor was explaining how you actually meet people where they’re at and

When I dig a little deeper though, just for me, I know that when people say it, they know what they mean. But to me, like meet the client where they’re at, almost to me feels like when you ask somebody how they’re doing and they’re like, I’m doing good, thank you. I don’t really know what that means. I don’t know what good means. You know, if you ask one person, what does meet the client where they’re at mean? They’ll give you an

example or they’ll give you an answer maybe somewhat like my professor in grad school. And I’m sure that as a Christian counselor you probably wouldn’t agree with the response that he gave back then. And so what is it that you say it is? Ask somebody that you know and see what they say about what that is. To me I kind of feel like it’s it’s it’s a little vague to my mind.

and the way I process things. So what does it really mean for us as Christian counselors? And how do we navigate this idea without compromising our faith or our ethical standards for that matter? And then how can we navigate this idea in ways that are going to honor our calling, but also our clients’ autonomy? So we want to explore this.

Camille McDaniel (02:30.294)
So if we’re looking at this phrase, meeting clients where they are, like I said, it’s pretty common. So by now you’re familiar with that. You’ve heard it, I’m sure, or you’ve seen it. I know in the last couple of weeks, I’ve seen that online as it relates to just responses to some questions that people posed about how to help clients and clients that might have different worldviews or.

a different path that they’re traveling in life. So when I hear it, and if we’re going to dive into it, let’s kind of talk about, especially for Christian counselors, what is all of this going to mean in real time? So on the one hand, it does sound compassionate.

And as therapists we do, we want to be empathetic and we want to understand where our clients are coming from. But then on the other hand, let’s look at what this looks like to meet them without judgment, especially if their choices that they’re making and things that they are sharing in the counseling office is drastically different than yours.

as your life, your worldview as the therapist. And so the truth is, is that the phrase can kind of lead us in a lot of different directions if we’re not careful. Okay. And so as Christians, we don’t want to simply just go with the flow of what sounds good or approach. We need kind of like an approach, if you will, that’s rooted in both our faith, but then also is rooted in ethics as well.

So let’s take a look at just the foundation. just talking two things that we need to think about if we are going to go down this path. And the first thing is that it needs to be right in an order, like our behavior, how we are going to meet the client, where they are at. We’re going to do that by first making sure that we’re being biblically sound. So that’s what I’m saying when I say like,

Camille McDaniel (04:50.188)
being right and in order. We want to make sure that our speech, our behavior is biblically sound. So it’s not about compromising or watering down our faith, right? We want to be able to instill hope. We want to be able to instill healing through Christ in a way that is compassionate, in a way that’s not judgmental. So we want to know first and foremost that in order to even go down the path of doing that,

offering counseling care and forming relationship, clinical relationship with our clients, we want to make sure that we are not then compromising or watering down our faith in the process. And here’s the thing. There are many ways to do this, even with clients who do not have our same faith. Why? Because there are certain principles, even in the Bible, that are just good no matter what your faith is.

How many clients are coming to you and they want more self control in a certain area in their life? Or maybe they want more joy in their life, more peace of their mind and of their soul and of, know, within their body, they just want to feel better. How many people are wanting to be kinder to themselves or to somebody else? Like who doesn’t want some of these things? But guess what?

Love, joy, peace, patience, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, gentleness, self-control. These can all be found in the book of Galatians under fruits of the spirit. Bam, look at that. And people may not necessarily say that they believe in the God that you serve, Jesus Christ.

But I think we can all get with a little more self-control in the world. I think we can all get with a bit more kindness, a bit more patience. And that’s just the end result of ordering our steps and ordering not just our steps as in behavior, but ordering our language and our behavior and our mindset in certain ways. there, again, it’s okay to be biblically sound.

Camille McDaniel (07:19.062)
It does not in any way mean that you are going to force your religion on anybody. But there are some principles, whether a person is a believer or not, that people can agree on.

The next thing we want to make sure in this foundation of being able to meet clients where they’re at, is we just want to make sure that we still, in meeting them where they’re at, we hold true to our ethical codes, okay? Because meeting them where they are doesn’t mean that we have to agree with everything that they do or that we have to align ourselves with everything that they do just so that we can kind of build

good rapport and make them feel, you know, seen and understood. So we want to hold true to those things so that we are able to operate right and in order both ethically and biblically. You know, when we talk about how to do it, because Jesus gives us so many examples when we talk about how to do this, you know, Christ came and he met with so many different people.

people who lived lives and had beliefs and had behaviors and mindsets that were vastly different than his. But he was still able to sit with many different people. He sat with tax collectors and cheaters and liars and murderers. He talked with the woman at the well who was a Samaritan woman and

by and large, her culture and who she was in society would have made it if Christ was following societal rules, he wouldn’t have been talking to her at all. He wouldn’t have been giving her the time of day. But he stopped and he did have a conversation with her. And in his delivery, he allowed her to be open about the things that were going on. He was calling out the things that was going on.

Camille McDaniel (09:37.994)
in her life without it being demeaning. He was offering her a new way as well and hope. So his delivery was one that allowed her to want to stay around and hear what he had to say. And that allowed him to share some truth, to offer hope, to offer everlasting healing.

There are many examples when we take a look at Christ in the Bible. There’s also the apostle Paul. And when I was like kind of going over how I wanted to share this topic and looking at the Bible as it related to this topic, just kind of, you know, just going through some preparation on a scripture I came across with regards to the apostle Paul.

really was something that I said, okay, let’s talk about this as well. Because sometimes I think we can kind of just like this scripture that I’m going to share with you. The way it’s talking, I have heard people talk in this way, like kind of meeting people where they’re at. And that kind of goes back to what my professor had said in grad school. But it kind of goes a little wonky.

And I think we have to understand this scripture so that we don’t take the wrong path. We don’t misinterpret what it’s trying to say. So in 1 Corinthians chapter nine, verse 20 through 22, the apostle Paul is speaking and he says, and I’m gonna just read this really quickly. He says, and to the Jews, I became as a Jew that I might win the Jews to those

who are under the law as under that law, I became like that, that I might win those who are under the law and to those who are without law as without law, but not being without law toward God or under the law toward Christ, that I might win those who are without law.

Camille McDaniel (12:02.998)
And to the weak, I became as weak, that I might win the week. I have become all things to all men that I might by all means save some.

And as I was doing research, I saw how this scripture sometimes was used in order to justify just mimicking or being a part of whatever other people were a part of so that you could possibly install hope and healing through Christ in their lives in a way that didn’t align with what the apostle Paul was talking about.

So the apostle Paul, as it goes back and it talks about that, even when he was ministering to people who lived as though they were under no law, like they were just totally lawless, right? But he was under the law. So he’s like, I went to those people who were without law, but I wasn’t without law toward God, but I was under the law of Christ, right? So it’s like, how do you go to individuals who don’t align?

with the way that you are living life without going against the God that you serve. And so as the apostle Paul talked about how he was all things to all people, remember he didn’t give up his beliefs to do that. And so then that takes us back around then to how did he do it then? And when we look at this,

This is going to be something that many of us are already doing, but maybe you just don’t break it down in this way. It reminded me of my grad school professor. So let me explain that in this way, I think the scripture sometimes can be misinterpreted. like my professor back in grad school had said in order to build rapport with clients and meet them where they’re at,

Camille McDaniel (14:11.894)
Sometimes you’re going to want to reflect the things that they’re doing or reflect the things that they’re saying. So if they happen to sit a certain way, like if they happen to cross their legs, you you might naturally just smoothly also sit in a similar fashion so that it kind of seems like you all are aligning or having things in common as far as behaviors, which can cause the person to relax a bit. It’s like, okay, I hear that, all right.

sounds pretty neat, I understand that concept. He’s like, if the person uses slang, you may want to use certain slang terms as well, just to kind of, you know, again, naturally put it in there. And I’m like, I’m digesting, okay, what might that look like? What kind of slang, okay, okay, I’m listening. They’re like, and if like your client curses, you know, you can also feel free to curse just to kind of, again,

align yourself so that you can create an environment where they feel understood and they feel like they connect with you. And that’s where I was like, okay. Now that, I don’t know about that one, because that doesn’t really align with me. Again, look, I’m not perfect person by any means. Matter of fact, there is no perfect Christian because that would literally negate the need for a savior. I’m not perfect, but I just don’t curse.

Funny story about that one, but I’ll get to that later if I don’t forget before the episode is over so that’s where becoming all things to all people that you might save some is Going down the wrong path. That’s not what the Apostle Paul meant because he was clear to say that even when he met with people who were under no law They were just totally lawless, right?

that he didn’t stop being under the law. He didn’t throw that to the wind. That’s not how he operated. And so, you know, the example that I got in grad school, it started off pretty all right. Like, you know, I’m like, okay, you know, mimicking posture or certain things like that. But there might be some things that maybe the client brings up and it’s like, well, I can’t mimic. Or there might be some things that, well, I don’t align with that, right? You know?

Camille McDaniel (16:32.615)
And that’s also where, again, being ethical, it’s going to be important for you to advertise yourself properly, openly and honestly, so that clients know what they are going to receive when they come to you for counseling. But what it’s going to look like when you are all things to all people that you might save some is, first of all, you don’t have to, again, water down your faith or anything, but come and no matter who you have in front of you,

Remember that they are still an individual who has been given life by God the Father and they have gifts and they have talents and there is a hope for them should they choose the path. They may not choose it. But remember you have somebody that the heavens look down on and have not given up on. Okay?

And so we don’t want to look at the person in front of us just because their life path may not reflect our life path and the things that they say or the things that they do are not things that we would say or things that we would do, right? We want to make sure that we are, and here’s the first one, listening. Yes, we listen. We listen a good bit in our field. We are listening, but we want to make sure that, because we’re human too, right?

And sometimes certain skills get a little bit rusty. And so when we have individuals who are in front of us that may walk life in ways that are drastically different than ours, listen for understanding, not just for responding, not just for thinking that there’s something that has to be immediately corrected. Listen to understand, listen to conceptualize.

How did they get here? How did this mindset form? How did these behaviors come about? How? What’s behind it? What’s at the root of it? All right? Okay. And the next thing that we want to then do, we want to empathize. Okay? Have compassion. Can you understand what it might be like?

Camille McDaniel (18:57.836)
I remember having certain clients that struggled with things that yeah, had them on a life path that didn’t look like mine, you know, but that’s not saying much. mean, I’m a pretty kind of like calm person. So it’s not like I’m just out there. I’m not, you know, doing a whole lot, you know, spontaneous and going here and going there. Not really. I’m kind of live like a calm life really. So, you know, there are a lot of things that certain clients might be doing that I don’t.

But even when I hear something in this session that I’m like, I don’t know about that one. I don’t know about that one. I’m not thinking, I don’t know about that as though it’s a sin. No, I’m thinking, I don’t know that it’s bringing the joy that the client is saying. Cause sometimes it’s really not. This is not me just like ignoring what my client is saying, not listening. This is me listening for understanding.

and then empathizing with how they may have gotten to this particular place and understanding how somebody might go down certain paths so that they can feel loved or so that they can feel value or so that they can be important in their own mind and they create that in ways that are maladaptive, not good for them. You wanna be able to empathize.

And then the other thing you want to do is honor your client’s autonomy. The client has the right to make their own decisions, their own choices. Adults. Now with children, they don’t have their own, you know, really full, full autonomy, nor do they have their own full, full confidentiality, depending on what it is that you’re talking about in the state that you’re in. There might be some age limits to that, that vary, but for sure, usually under 18.

And then there are some nuances when it comes to like substance abuse. So you want to honor the client’s ability to make their own choices. You know, it is, it is easy to be able to give a client a quick solution. It is so much harder to sit with a person through their own process, the ups, the downs, the regression, the progress, the regression.

Camille McDaniel (21:23.456)
progress, right? But we are there to walk with them through the journey. Have compassion, listen for understanding, and know that they get to make their own choices. And you pray, you pray that the time that they are with you, there might be a seed planted or change that occurs while you’re with them. But you honored their ability to make their own choices just the way

We have all made our own choices and our lives are not squeaky clean. And we’ve had highs and we’ve had lows and you just happen to be sitting with somebody in the midst of their lows. And so you don’t want to be put off by what those lows look like. Somebody might be put off by your lows, but thankfully, prayerfully, there was somebody there in the midst. We already know God was there. And prayerfully you did then.

get to a place and it didn’t take you too, too long, but maybe it did, to turn it all around, to become the individual that you are today sitting in front of somebody who needs that same understanding in their life and a safe space to be able to allow it all to unfold. The next thing we want to be able to do is provide accountability and encouragement. So in the midst of what’s going on, no matter what it is, no matter

how wrong it might be and how it’s kind of going downhill and it just doesn’t seem like this is the way the person should be. Are there any wins? Is there anything that’s going well? Try to identify the things that are going well. Try to encourage them in those areas that are going well and areas where they are being protective of their own heart, their own self, you know, in areas where they are exhibiting the…

the self-control or they’ve experienced the peace or the love, know, hold them accountable, accountable to the goals that they have set for themselves within the counseling space, but then also encourage them along the way. Even in the midst of certain things that may not seem like they’re going well, you might be able to find a win if you are, if you’re looking close enough, even if it’s a really small one. So,

Camille McDaniel (23:48.238)
Ultimately, when we’re talking about how to meet the client where we’re at, hopefully I’ve given some perspective on how we can be in multiple spaces, multiple places, but we can also kind of allow ourselves to not water down our faith while we’re doing so. And thankfully I did not forget, popped back into my mind, the story.

Quick little story. So I’m not an individual when you talk about like, you know, language and stuff. I’m not really, I’m not an individual who curses, right? So I had this one client many years ago where, yeah, cursing, you know, I have many clients who curse, but this particular client, I would have to oftentimes just because of the way that they would convey certain thoughts, I would reflect back to them what they had said, oftentimes to make sure that I was

clear that I heard their true intent and that I heard the meaning correctly before I would move on. And so I would just kind of paraphrase around the curse words. And, and I mean, I didn’t make any big deal about it. Like I said, I seamlessly smoothly just keep it moving. You know, you don’t have to make a big deal with some of this stuff. This is where the person’s at in life. You’re, you’re with them on their journey. You don’t have to do the same things, but you know, do do what’s good for you.

and allow them to be who they are in front of you. Okay? So I don’t curse. So whenever I was kind of reflecting just for understanding and meaning and such, I would, again, like I said, I would just kind of go around. The curse words, would paraphrase it. Well, the client caught on after a little while and just kind of just said, because it’s such a cool person, very…

very interesting experience that I had during my time with them and a lot of growth that I was able to do as a clinician with that individual, but they just were like, wait, hold on. Do you not curse? And so I was like, I really don’t. I don’t. And the thing that I thought was kind of cool about that was that oftentimes, like in the counseling room, some of my clients,

Camille McDaniel (26:11.342)
have cursed and then they apologize for cursing. And some of them will be like, oh, I know you’re a Christian, I’m sorry. And I will easily say, this is your session, this is your time. Talk how you need to talk, say what you need to say. You’re fine, this is your time. I’m not going to come undone because of…

because of how you are presenting your thoughts. And I am definitely not about to be correcting somebody, an adult who is speaking in a way that is most comfortable for them. And it’s not vulgar and it’s not graphic. It’s to the point where maybe there might be some other things going on. Because I do want to make sure that I just stop for a minute to say, it’s not saying that everything and all things are okay.

but it is saying like, it’s not like they’re being graphically vulgar in order to get some kind of, you know, like reaction out of me and all of that, like, no, nothing like that. They are, they are literally not targeting me. They are just talking and sharing with me their life or their challenge or whatever the story may be. And they have to sprinkle it with curse words. So this particular, this particular client would then continue to say things for a couple of sessions.

They did this and purposely add in more curse words just to see how well I could still kind of clarify or kind of present back to them the thought, the meaning, the intent of what they were saying. And after a while they were just like, you’re doing good, you’re keeping up. So I find it kind of funny, but here’s the thing that I also

liked about that interaction is that it switched it from the client feeling like they need to apologize to the client feeling like I’m the quirky one. So there is no power differential present where it’s like, the therapist looking down on me because I present this way, I speak my thoughts this way, or I’ve had these particular encounters.

Camille McDaniel (28:33.548)
It is very humbling for me. am very honored that they can come and feel comfortable to share in the way that they know how and not feel like I am judging them. And if anything, I’d rather them judge me by thinking I’m a little quirky that I don’t do a certain thing that they do versus have them sitting there kind of feeling like they might be a little less than.

just because I happen to be an individual who follows Christ, because Christ is for anyone who wants to follow him as he showed when he walked this earth and sat with people of all different walks of life. that was my story. I’m glad I remembered that. I almost forgot. It’s no telling. You talk long enough, then you will possibly forget what you had wanted to say.

Either way, I hope that you gained value from the episode today. And if you have any comments that you would like to share, whether you are listening to me or whether you are watching me on YouTube and listening, then by all means, put a comment, ask a question, join us in the Facebook group. Join us with everything that we’re doing online.

I have some wonderful things coming up for you in the middle, about the middle of the year almost, a little after, right before the third quarter. Super excited about it. my goodness. But more to come, more to come, more to come on that later. But until then, continue to keep the faith, continue to practice your faith, continue to be the best clinician because the world absolutely needs

you. God bless.

CPP Ep. 34 How to Keep Clients Engaged Between Sessions in Private Practice